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	<title>Comments on: To Hell in a Handbasket</title>
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	<link>http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/</link>
	<description>Unity in charity, diversity in truth</description>
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		<title>By: Clara</title>
		<link>http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/comment-page-1/#comment-29906</link>
		<dc:creator>Clara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Jan 2008 06:33:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/#comment-29906</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think it can be obviously shown that things are getting better, or that things are getting worse. Nathan, in my opinion (and this is based on a long history, not just on that comment), has entirely too optimistic a view of the modern world. :)

But Trads may tend towards the other extreme, which is why I thought it might be fun to poke at them with that little post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think it can be obviously shown that things are getting better, or that things are getting worse. Nathan, in my opinion (and this is based on a long history, not just on that comment), has entirely too optimistic a view of the modern world. :)</p>
<p>But Trads may tend towards the other extreme, which is why I thought it might be fun to poke at them with that little post.</p>
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		<title>By: elmwood</title>
		<link>http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/comment-page-1/#comment-29616</link>
		<dc:creator>elmwood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jan 2008 04:28:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/#comment-29616</guid>
		<description>STD&#039;s are clearly rising among young people, especially HPV. the birth rates are only up because of illegal and legal immigration. in general, white and native born americans are not having lots of kids. hispanic and asians are the fastest growing population groups. 

it all depends where you look and how you look at the data. some good signs, some very bad signs--the threat of a nuclear terrorist attack, the pollution problem in china, our country&#039;s wasteful unsustainable lifestyle, the rise of islam in europe, the attacks on christians by islam, resistant staph infections in hospitals, globalization, the power of the industrial military complex, secularization, poor catholic catechesis.... etc. 

i wouldn&#039;t say things are getting worse, but they are not getting better.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>STD&#8217;s are clearly rising among young people, especially HPV. the birth rates are only up because of illegal and legal immigration. in general, white and native born americans are not having lots of kids. hispanic and asians are the fastest growing population groups. </p>
<p>it all depends where you look and how you look at the data. some good signs, some very bad signs&#8211;the threat of a nuclear terrorist attack, the pollution problem in china, our country&#8217;s wasteful unsustainable lifestyle, the rise of islam in europe, the attacks on christians by islam, resistant staph infections in hospitals, globalization, the power of the industrial military complex, secularization, poor catholic catechesis&#8230;. etc. </p>
<p>i wouldn&#8217;t say things are getting worse, but they are not getting better.</p>
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		<title>By: Nathan Smith</title>
		<link>http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/comment-page-1/#comment-29529</link>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jan 2008 12:05:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/#comment-29529</guid>
		<description>Things are getting better in the wider world, too. There&#039;s less communist tyranny, less war, and lately, less poverty. But birthrates are falling worldwide, except in the US and a couple of European countries. That helps countries alleviate poverty because a larger share of the population is working, but it might be a bad thing from the Catholic point of view.

Also, long-run trends in church membership are positive in America: it&#039;s increased from 20% or so in the colonial period to 60% or so in the 1980s. I&#039;m not sure of the most recent numbers or specifically for Catholics. Europe has definitely moved in the other direction, with a collapse of religion, and of birthrates, although birthrates are recovering in a few countries such as Denmark and the Netherlands.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Things are getting better in the wider world, too. There&#8217;s less communist tyranny, less war, and lately, less poverty. But birthrates are falling worldwide, except in the US and a couple of European countries. That helps countries alleviate poverty because a larger share of the population is working, but it might be a bad thing from the Catholic point of view.</p>
<p>Also, long-run trends in church membership are positive in America: it&#8217;s increased from 20% or so in the colonial period to 60% or so in the 1980s. I&#8217;m not sure of the most recent numbers or specifically for Catholics. Europe has definitely moved in the other direction, with a collapse of religion, and of birthrates, although birthrates are recovering in a few countries such as Denmark and the Netherlands.</p>
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		<title>By: Clara</title>
		<link>http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/comment-page-1/#comment-29376</link>
		<dc:creator>Clara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jan 2008 00:39:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/#comment-29376</guid>
		<description>If you&#039;re suggesting that &lt;i&gt;The Economist&lt;/i&gt; is basically depraved with regards to questions of morals or religion, I quite agree. But I still find it to be amusing and informative, as apparently do you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you&#8217;re suggesting that <i>The Economist</i> is basically depraved with regards to questions of morals or religion, I quite agree. But I still find it to be amusing and informative, as apparently do you.</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph Shaw</title>
		<link>http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/comment-page-1/#comment-29344</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph Shaw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jan 2008 11:34:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/#comment-29344</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m surprised that The Economist regards illegitimacy as a bad thing. Isn&#039;t that just a lifestyle choice? I assume that &#039;teenage pregnancies&#039; (even of happily married 19-year-olds, presumably) are a &#039;bad thing&#039; because of their detrimental effect on the proportion of women in the workforce.

Maybe I&#039;ve been reading The Economist too long...

Happy New Year!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m surprised that The Economist regards illegitimacy as a bad thing. Isn&#8217;t that just a lifestyle choice? I assume that &#8216;teenage pregnancies&#8217; (even of happily married 19-year-olds, presumably) are a &#8216;bad thing&#8217; because of their detrimental effect on the proportion of women in the workforce.</p>
<p>Maybe I&#8217;ve been reading The Economist too long&#8230;</p>
<p>Happy New Year!</p>
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		<title>By: Clara</title>
		<link>http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/comment-page-1/#comment-29193</link>
		<dc:creator>Clara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 07:04:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/#comment-29193</guid>
		<description>It looks to me, Tom, as though the stats you cite relate to illegitimacy generally, not specifically to teens. So it would be possible for teen pregnancies to go down while the number of births to unmarried women generally went up. Actually, &lt;i&gt;The Economist&lt;/i&gt; did mention a few bad trends later in the article, including increased illegitimacy, but in the interests of brevity I didn&#039;t get into all of it. The bottom line was that, in their estimation, there seemed to be a lot more good news than bad news.

Ah! Tomorrow night I will sit at my own computer again... and watch the college football national championship on my own television. I can hardly wait!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It looks to me, Tom, as though the stats you cite relate to illegitimacy generally, not specifically to teens. So it would be possible for teen pregnancies to go down while the number of births to unmarried women generally went up. Actually, <i>The Economist</i> did mention a few bad trends later in the article, including increased illegitimacy, but in the interests of brevity I didn&#8217;t get into all of it. The bottom line was that, in their estimation, there seemed to be a lot more good news than bad news.</p>
<p>Ah! Tomorrow night I will sit at my own computer again&#8230; and watch the college football national championship on my own television. I can hardly wait!</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Smith</title>
		<link>http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/comment-page-1/#comment-29170</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 03:23:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/#comment-29170</guid>
		<description>Well as a Catholic I would be concerned about the growing inability to hear Auricular Confessions.
Check my math -http://quickbeamoffangorn.wordpress.com/2007/12/19/confession-and-priest-shortage-do-the-math-mission-impossible/

I think the Economist must have gotten some bad or outdated figures on teen age birth rates.

Centers for Disease Control
Childbearing by unmarried women rose substantially in 2006, reaching record high levels. The birth rate rose 7 percent in 2006 to 50.6 per 1,000 unmarried women aged 15–44 years; the number of births to unmarried women increased by nearly 8 percent in 2006 to 1,641,700.
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr56/nvsr56_07.pdf

Lastly, as a Cradle Catholic Irish American it&#039;s taken 5 generations of doom, gloom, and poor cooking to develop such a highly skilled level of guilt.

Nothing is more depressing that not having anything to be depressed about, one can only be happy when your feeling guilty.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well as a Catholic I would be concerned about the growing inability to hear Auricular Confessions.<br />
Check my math -http://quickbeamoffangorn.wordpress.com/2007/12/19/confession-and-priest-shortage-do-the-math-mission-impossible/</p>
<p>I think the Economist must have gotten some bad or outdated figures on teen age birth rates.</p>
<p>Centers for Disease Control<br />
Childbearing by unmarried women rose substantially in 2006, reaching record high levels. The birth rate rose 7 percent in 2006 to 50.6 per 1,000 unmarried women aged 15–44 years; the number of births to unmarried women increased by nearly 8 percent in 2006 to 1,641,700.<br />
<a href="http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr56/nvsr56_07.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr56/nvsr56_07.pdf</a></p>
<p>Lastly, as a Cradle Catholic Irish American it&#8217;s taken 5 generations of doom, gloom, and poor cooking to develop such a highly skilled level of guilt.</p>
<p>Nothing is more depressing that not having anything to be depressed about, one can only be happy when your feeling guilty.</p>
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		<title>By: Discipulus</title>
		<link>http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/comment-page-1/#comment-29165</link>
		<dc:creator>Discipulus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 02:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/#comment-29165</guid>
		<description>I’m not a pessimist but I didn’t realize how rosy things are until I read those statistics from The economist.  Still, I guess it’s hard for traditionalists to be upbeat, with so many negative forces working against us, like depletion of the ozone and Global warming and all. 

On the positive side, not to mention that the George Washington Bridge is still standing, I feel a lot more safe these days, now that the Homeland Security Act is in place.  And you really feel protected while traveling, especially at the airports with all of the security and surveillance.  Schools, too, are doing a better job in educating—at least schools with x-ray scanners and police at the doors.  Industrialization, once responsible for devastating the countryside and concentrating the population into the cities, is on the wane and people are now fleeing cities like Detroit looking for jobs elsewhere.  Fortunately, they can find them in the tourist industry, especially as the dollar weakens, making the visiting of the U.S. an attractive deal—kind of like a Third World Country. And as crime decreases, we may see the day when prisons are closed  and sold at a faster rate than Catholic Churches.  

No, seriously, I agree there are a lot of signs for hope but we can’t become complaisant.  The battle still wages. The youth now attending the Traditional Mass in increasing numbers need to be injected with the spirit of a Church Militant.  Too often they fall in line with our decadent society. But yes, Happy New Year!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I’m not a pessimist but I didn’t realize how rosy things are until I read those statistics from The economist.  Still, I guess it’s hard for traditionalists to be upbeat, with so many negative forces working against us, like depletion of the ozone and Global warming and all. </p>
<p>On the positive side, not to mention that the George Washington Bridge is still standing, I feel a lot more safe these days, now that the Homeland Security Act is in place.  And you really feel protected while traveling, especially at the airports with all of the security and surveillance.  Schools, too, are doing a better job in educating—at least schools with x-ray scanners and police at the doors.  Industrialization, once responsible for devastating the countryside and concentrating the population into the cities, is on the wane and people are now fleeing cities like Detroit looking for jobs elsewhere.  Fortunately, they can find them in the tourist industry, especially as the dollar weakens, making the visiting of the U.S. an attractive deal—kind of like a Third World Country. And as crime decreases, we may see the day when prisons are closed  and sold at a faster rate than Catholic Churches.  </p>
<p>No, seriously, I agree there are a lot of signs for hope but we can’t become complaisant.  The battle still wages. The youth now attending the Traditional Mass in increasing numbers need to be injected with the spirit of a Church Militant.  Too often they fall in line with our decadent society. But yes, Happy New Year!</p>
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		<title>By: JK</title>
		<link>http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/comment-page-1/#comment-29146</link>
		<dc:creator>JK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jan 2008 23:59:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/#comment-29146</guid>
		<description>But now I have a song from the musical &quot;Oklahoma&quot; running through my head.  &quot;Everything&#039;s up to date in Kansas City.  They&#039;ve gone about as far as they can go. ...&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But now I have a song from the musical &#8220;Oklahoma&#8221; running through my head.  &#8220;Everything&#8217;s up to date in Kansas City.  They&#8217;ve gone about as far as they can go. &#8230;&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Clara</title>
		<link>http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/comment-page-1/#comment-29071</link>
		<dc:creator>Clara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jan 2008 08:42:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/#comment-29071</guid>
		<description>How very wonderful! I did not know that things were so good in Kansas City, but it certainly cheers me to hear it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How very wonderful! I did not know that things were so good in Kansas City, but it certainly cheers me to hear it.</p>
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		<title>By: dustiam</title>
		<link>http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/comment-page-1/#comment-29019</link>
		<dc:creator>dustiam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jan 2008 01:13:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.cornellsociety.org/2008/01/to-hell-in-a-handbasket/#comment-29019</guid>
		<description>You&#039;re not speaking about pessimism in the traditional Catholic communities in Kansas City!  We have it so good that our enthusiasm and optimism for the future can&#039;t help but follow along.  At least 250 people (half children) came to our Saturday morning Mass today.  At least six Latin Masses each Sunday, too.  In addition, two or three sets of traditional Catholic nuns.  Don&#039;t forget the good number of traditional Kansas City Catholic bloggers, as well.  God is very, very good to us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re not speaking about pessimism in the traditional Catholic communities in Kansas City!  We have it so good that our enthusiasm and optimism for the future can&#8217;t help but follow along.  At least 250 people (half children) came to our Saturday morning Mass today.  At least six Latin Masses each Sunday, too.  In addition, two or three sets of traditional Catholic nuns.  Don&#8217;t forget the good number of traditional Kansas City Catholic bloggers, as well.  God is very, very good to us.</p>
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